I saw him yesterday at his press conference. Shanny's ego was on hand. The so called "genius" that passed on Mahomes and Watson for C. J. Beathard, has full autonomy to pick his man. Lynch, a GM in name only has no say in the decision. Their chief scout and his deputies have no say in the decision. Shouldn't this be a time for intervention? Friends don't let friends draft smug. Note to Shanny, improved arm talent and playmaking ability are needed more than improved processing. Your offensive calling card is that you can manufacture an effective passing game without an elite processor. Pretty much what you've been doing with, Jimmy and Mullens. Two weak armed backups. Adding another weak armed talent with the mind of Albert Einstein isn't the answer. I don't care how beautiful it is, his body is the cover art for the latest edition of, Lazy Frat Boys.
What this looks like to me is Shanny is now Trent Baalke. If this quarterback busts, Shanny's job security will not be in jeopardy according to a report by Tony Pauline. Shanny has tremendous job security, and anyone else that would have the nonsensical temerity to give up #12, 2022 and 2023 1st round picks for Mac Jones, and he didn't turn out to be the next Drew Brees; would be sacked without any question or explanation.
There are those fans that just want to be in the winning mix. We got to the Super Bowl despite missing on Mahomes and Watson. Remember when we were undefeated in Super Bowls? 5-0 baby! Last two Super Bowl appearances we choked. Last two Shanny Super Bowl appearances he choked. No more choking. I don't want to just be a relevant winner. I want to be a champion again. I want to be the organization with the most Lombardi Trophies in the headquarters trophy case. That's what I need and I hope I'm not being too presumptuous when I say, that's what most fans need.
Nice write up, it has to be Lance cuz he has almost the same amount olayed in college as Jones,and in terms of processing reads i dont
ReplyDeletethink there is difference.
Thanks, Robber.
DeleteNice, Razor.
ReplyDeleteYah, I hope people don't think we are being unfair. For me, the reason I am so animated about this pick is that I truly believe this pick is going to tell me exactly what direction this team is heading over the next 5 years.
A couple things that did bother me at the presser (By the way, it certainly wasn't all bad):
Kyle says there are 5 QB's in this draft who are capable of being the Niners starting QB. IMO, you don't give up 3 firsts and a third in order to move from 12 to 3, if there are truly 5 QB who are capable of leading the 49ers to a Super Bowl victory.
Also, I got the sense that Jimmy is as good as gone. It feels personal now, between Kyle and Jimmy, and I don't think that serves the team well. Yet, mark my words .... Jimmy G. will not take another snap under Kyle Shanahan.
And one last thing ... how in the world could Justin Fields no longer be in the conversation at 3, if he's obviously one of the "five" QB's Kyle seems capable of leading the Niners to the promise land. He's the man. He's the consensus 2nd best QB in this entire draft. Whether he truly is the 2nd best remains to be seen, but he fits the mold Kyle talked about a few months ago, much better than Mac Jones, that's for shizzle!
Thanks, 49Reasons. If Shanny is already starting to crack from all the scrutiny, what's gonna happen when he drafts Jones? Every int, every 3 and out, every hiccup will amp up the scrutiny level. If he thinks it's bad now, wait until he finds out he drafted Drew Bledsoe and not Drew Brees.
DeleteOMG, no doubt, Razor. There's no question in my mind that there will be a tremendous amount of added pressure on Mac Jones, relative to Lance or Fields, not just from the 49ers fan base, but also at the national level.
DeleteMac Jones may be Kyle's preferred QB, but there is absolutely no question as to where Mac Jones stands with the Faithful. And there is also no question where Mac Jones stands in the minds of the national media.
I am not saying that this should be a major determeninitve factor in selecting the QB, but it is a fact none the less. And it will matter if Mac Jones struggles, which like most rookies, he likely will.
Hey Razor, what do you think is going to happen with Jimmy G.? I'm curious if you think he'll be the Niners starting QB this season, or of he's likely to be playing elsewhere? And do you think the best thing to do is keep Jimmy around this season, taking pressure off of the rookie while giving the team the best chance to win, at least early on in the season?
I personally doubt Jimmy will ever take a snap for Kyle again. I could be wrong, but that's my read on the situation.
I took 'em at their word earlier but after the presser; I agree that Jimmy G will never, ever take another snap for this team.
DeleteAnd for the record, I think John and Kyle have done a pretty darn good job over the last 4 years. I hasn't been perfect. Kyle's love affair for Kirk Cousins really took it's toll on ShanaLynch's first draft. And let's face it, Kyle gets a failing grade for the way he's handled the QB position, outside of Jimmy G., who fell into his lap back in 2017.
ReplyDeleteAnd like I said yesterday, I get the sense that Kyle wants the QB he envisions starting this September, rather than looking at who has the best chance at being special 1 year from now, and I think that's the wrong approach.
ReplyDeleteI know, I know, Trey Lance was asked to take a deeper dive in running ND State's offense, so the theory is that he might be ready to start just as soon as Jones. But Lance has played 1 game since the end of 2019, and that is a major concern, NOT LONG TERM, but in terms of being ready to start as a rookie.
Now, that said, I would argue that Justin Fields is most prepared to start in September, because he's been playing championship level football at the FBS level, for the last 2 years, and he's been consistently facing the highest level of competition of all the top 5 prospects, and frankly, it's not even close. We know Fields has been the #2 prospect for 4 years running, and that shouldn't change based on 2 rather average performances VS 2 excellent FBS defenses. And BTW, Fields outplayed Lawrence, by a large margin, just a few months ago. He showed everything in that game - toughness, heart, accuracy at all levels, working deep into his progressions, using his legs to avoid pressure, while showing off his 4.4 speed, and throwing some of the most beautiful deep balls you will ever see.
You talk about "putting it all together", Justin Fields did just that, on the biggest stage, against one of the nations best defenses, while facing down his biggest QB rival, and it was spectacular to watch!
I know some of you guys don't necessarily agree with me, but if I am right about Jimmy G. being as good as gone, well then it's not hard to imagine that Kyle's looking for a starting QB day 1, I think we can agree on that.
49Reasons, yeah, he said "starting quarterback" several times, which suggests Fields or Jones, Lance not so much. He also said his ideal would be a Drew Brees with the legs of Lamar Jackson, which muddies the waters even more than they were.
DeleteI am a Lance guy all the way and have been on the Lance train for over 3 months but I won't rip KS or JL if they draft Jones. The two most dificult tasks in pro football are drafting QB's and hiring HC's.. The failure rate for QB's drafted in the 1st round is somewhere around 60 to 70%. If it were easy Brady wouldn't have gone in the 5th, Montana wouldn't have gone in the 3rd andWarner wouldn't have been a UDFA. So I hope we draft Lance but if its Jones I will immediatley will become his #1 fan.
ReplyDeleteGood to see you back here.
DeleteHey, OldCoach. Agree with, George. Good to see you!
DeleteShanny is going to draft Jones so you can go ahead and pre-order his jersey.
Not so fast about Jones. I'd say though that if his evaluations of Fields and Lance were that neither were capable of being his eyes on the field, then I couldn't blame him. The assumption is that each one is, but that's jumping the gun.
DeleteGlad to see you back Coach.
DeleteI’ve always said that Lance has the highest ceiling, but he also has the highest boom vs bust effect for me.
And while many will ostracize Shanahan if he goes with Jones, I would be fine with it based on the condition that Shanahan would have done all his due diligence before drafting him.
Does Shanahan have an ego as some have suggested? Perhaps.
But this could be said of likely half of the head coaches in the NFL. Shanahan is certainly not the lone exception.
Jones has a proven track record that speaks volumes and a National Title (over Fields) to go with it.
Fields and Lance are the sexy modern age QBs. Yet, no one can deny that the pocket QB has been the most prolific Super Bowl winner over the last 40 years.
You guys keep forgiving Shanny for selecting Beathard over Mahomes and Watson in the hope that Cousins would be made available. I'm sorry, but I can't blindly follow this guy into quarterback hell. He's proven nothing to me as far as developing a quarterback. I can't get on board drafting the best fit over the best player. Not for 3 1st's and sorry, Shanny that's what it is. #'s 12, 2022, and 2023. 3 FIRST ROUND PICKS SHANNY! Quit trying to wiggle out of that one.
DeleteRaz,
DeleteI guess that I could rake Shanahan over the coals for his past mistakes. But what quells the anger for me is the fact that he took a dumpster fire of a team to the SB in only his 3rd year. Regardless of his draft misses, I view that as a huge accomplishment.
I may be wrong, but If I recall, weren’t you in favor of the Solomon Thomas pick? Point being, we really don’t know what any of these players will become until year two or three.
The big 3 QBs left on board for us are Lance, Jones and Fields. I’d be fine with either one simply because one of them would land on a talented team team built to win.
AES, I'm flattered you equate my opinion to that of Shanny but I'm not the football genius.
DeleteRight there with you OC. And same goes for Fields.
DeleteGood to see you posting here again!
Hey guys, Elijah Moore at #43?
DeleteWhat say you? Either that, or a versatile corner at #43?
Yah, I'm ready to think past the first round pick. Can you believe it? Lol
I had Moore in my first mock at #43. I'm on board with it. But I keep hearing that many teams have Moore as the 4th best WR in the draft, so I expect he will be long gone by pick 43.
DeleteSo, more important? A versatile CB, another WR, or a DE?
DeleteBTW, Kyle's digs at Jimmy G seemed personal to me, and unnecessary, IMO. And I don't think it served any good purpose!
DeleteAlso, some of these national talking heads are truly uninformed. This guy - JIM NAGY, just said that the Niners traded up before ever watching Justin Fields throw the ball, lol. Are you kidding me? Kyle's been around Justin for years, and his "personal" scouts have been working with Justin and Trey for a while. Kyle knows Justin Fields as well as any player in this draft class! He's never seen him throw before the trade? OMG!
DeleteRazor, I can sense your frustration on missing out on Mahomes and Watson, especially since at Mahome's pro day Lynch told Shanahan there was something special there. Then we drafted Thomas, and the rest is history. I've faulted Shanahan myself as a player evaluator (Joe Williams, Bethard, Pettis) and the fact that he's been at the controls during the loss of two Super Bowls when his teams were on their way to winning. Here's hoping he's learned from his mistakes, as that's all we can do. I do think he learned something from the Pettis fiasco. We'll just have to see on Thursday.
ReplyDeleteYea, I'm afraid it is a fait accompli that Jones is the selection. I don't believe this is going to end well for the organization. I hope I'm wrong but I've got a very bad feeling about this. Shanny has way too much power, and York has developed the same type of relationship he had with Baalke. This move could set us back years, and guess what? According to Tony Pauline, it won't matter. The Shanny's aren't going to be dying anytime soon. They are going to be around for a very long time.
DeleteWell, I'm gonna contradict myself regarding what I said above that hoping he's learned from his mistakes is all we can do. Life's too short to bang your head against the wall for a franchise that's built to disappoint. There are other teams to root for.
DeleteThe hot take of the day seems to be Shanahan is arrogant if he takes Jones. What does that even mean? If he takes Jones - it hasn't been confirmed yet no matter what the belief is right now - it's because he's come to the conclusion that Jones is the best guy to help him win now and in the future. From what I'm reading in the media and the fan sites, everyone seems to believe they know better than the HC and designer of the offense who fits best in his system. That is arrogance of the highest order. How about we let the guy who has the best idea of who he needs make the decision and see where it goes? If it doesn't work out you'll have plenty of time for I told you so's.
ReplyDeleteCan you tell me how we went from, Jimmy is our guy for '21 and we had to be comfortable with 3 guys, to saying Jimmy might not be alive and we see 5 guys as potential starters?
DeleteArrogance? If I'm printing the definition, I would use not scouting Mahomes because Cousins is the best as my FIRST example.
I'm following the breadcrumbs left by Shanny in his presser. My instincts tell me the choice is Jones. For others like myself, let's hope I'm wrong.
Of course Shanahan has an ego and is arrogant. Most coaches (and players) do.
DeleteWhat I find a little funny and ironic is that fans dislike this arrogance if it means he won't take the QB they want, because they know better than him who fits his offense.
Ugh, no. Arrogance bit him in the Super Bowl against Atlanta. It bit him again as the one he passed over licked his pristine defense, which may have contributed to him forgetting to run the football again. It bit him once again by holding onto both Beathard and Mullens instead of moving on and upgrading the backup. It bit with the McKinnon contract.
DeleteKind of emotional huh?
DeleteIt's an emotional game, Jerry. Nice to hear from you. Must be tired of bouncing ideas off of oneniner, brucelee and ribico, huh?
DeleteRazoreater,
DeleteWe went from Jimmy is our guy to drafting somebody because they ultimately agreed with you that Garoppolo is too injury prone. He said that exact thing yesterday so there really is no gray area about why they did this. I guess we disagree on the arrogance angle because I see no reason to criticize the HC/OC for believing he knows the QB who fits his offense best. I'm not a big fan of Jones either but if we really weigh all the factors involved it really shouldn't come as a big surprise that he's the favorite in the clubhouse. Every football analyst I've read or heard talk about him says the same things: He has the best accuracy, anticipation and understanding of what he's seeing defensively of any QB in the draft. That's a Shanahan QB like it or not.
Notanexpert, I've given Shanny plenty of leash. He's the genius. I'm a fan with an opinion, and I think he has too much power. I think his arrogance has bitten him not once, but multiple times. If this blows up, Tony Pauline is reporting his job is safe. No accountability. I can't get onboard with this no matter how much I like Shanny.
DeleteDoes Kyle know more than the rest of his personnel department, Notanexpert?
DeleteNo offense to Kyle but, yah, I trust the collective brainpower of his top scouts. I trust the collective brainpower of all of the experts. And I have to look no further than Kyle's own track record when it comes to evaluating QB's. It's a tough thing to do.
No offense to Kyle, but there is a certain skill set involved with evaluating NFL prospects. It's a different skill set than coordinating the offense or being the head coach. Some of the most successful people of our time understood this, and for me, that goes to the arrogance. It's OK to defer to the experts. Understanding your own limitations doesn't make you weak minded or any less smart. That's my point. I know what I like to eat, but that doesn't make me a nutritionist, right?
Kyle seems to think he's the smartest coach, smartest offensive play designer and play caller, and smartest scout and talent evaluator on the planet. At least that's the vibe I get, so yah, I think it's fair to call him arrogant if he refuses to listen to all of these other people, some of which have actually won a Super Bowl. whether they are former players, ex-coaches, high level scouts, etc.
I think Kyle's issues when it comes to evaluating talent, is that he has tunnel vision. There seem to be certain traits that he looks for, and those traits trump every other trait. He sees the individual traits, while other trained eyes see the collective ability. Being a great processor doesn't make you a great QB, if you're lacking in other areas, right? For instance, I'll take the guy who might be slightly less efficient of a processor, if he's a good enough processor, and more than makes up for it in other areas. And it seems like it's the intangibles that Kyle tends to overlook the most. He seems to fall in love with a player based on individual traits, instead of the entire package of traits.
DeleteLook no further than Dante Pettis, CJ Beathard, Nick Mullens, Joe Williams. Those are all guys we know Kyle pounded the table for because he fell in love with certain traits.
Not only that, it seems like Kyle doesn't fully appreciate the costs of doing business either. He's very good at identifying undrafted ed RB's, but he still pushes to sign a guy like McKinnon, even though the cost is prohibitive.
These are the kinds of things that are better off left to your top personnel guys. That's why you pay them the big bucks.
Razoreater,
DeleteHe's made mistakes no question about it, but he's also put together a SB contender so you take the bad with the good. Power is only a problem if you don't know how to use it. I haven't seen any evidence of that being the case with Shanahan.
49reasons,
How do you know all his scouts disagree with him? Have you talked to them personally? You put way too much credibility into rumors. Nothing gets out of that building that they don't want to get out. We've seen that multiple times now so why do you believe everything you read or hear?
I think Kyle's issues when it comes to evaluating talent, is that he has tunnel vision. There seem to be certain traits that he looks for, and those traits trump every other trait. He sees the individual traits, while other trained eyes see the collective ability. Being a great processor doesn't make you a great QB, if you're lacking in other areas, right? For instance, I'll take the guy who might be slightly less efficient of a processor, if he's a good enough processor, and more than makes up for it in other areas. And it seems like it's the intangibles that Kyle tends to overlook the most. He seems to fall in love with a player based on individual traits, instead of the entire package of traits.
DeleteLook no further than Dante Pettis, CJ Beathard, Nick Mullens, Joe Williams. Those are all guys we know Kyle pounded the table for because he fell in love with certain traits.
Not only that, it seems like Kyle doesn't fully appreciate the costs of doing business either. He's very good at identifying undrafted ed RB's, but he still pushes to sign a guy like McKinnon, even though the cost is prohibitive.
These are the kinds of things that are better off left to your top personnel guys. That's why you pay them the big bucks.
Everyone has tunnel vision in some areas. It's why teams are doing well if they hit on 40 to 50 percent of their picks. The Niners are no different and as I mentioned to Razoreater above, Shanahan has made mistakes but he's also hit on quite a few which is why this team is a SB contender. I don't buy the argument that he doesn't listen to anybody else in the building. The Solomon Thomas pick was Lynch more than Shanahan as are most of the defensive players selected because Shanahan admittedly has more of an eye for offense. You pointed out Pettis but left out Deebo. Joe Williams was a mistake but what about the fact he consistently has one of the best running games in the league with castoffs or UDFA's? Nobody is infallible but the key is putting together a roster by any means necessary and they have done that.
I think that it’s a bit unreasonable and a little umm, arrogant to believe that Shanahan does not communicate with his assistants, scouts and Lynch.
DeleteI would venture that the entire brain trust agree with Shanahan that this team needs a QB. And they also believe that the head coach is more apt to make the decision on who that QB should be.
I don’t see any arrogance in Shanahan making the call, after all, I’m sure that he is aware of the blowback if the pick fails.
Sounds like Shanahan is willing to live and die by the sword (metaphor of course) on this. I can respect that.
OK, well if we are going to bring up Deebo, then we have to acknowledge he chose Deebo over DK Metcalf, right?
DeleteListen, I'm not all down on Kyle. I think he's a fantastic coach and offensive coordinator. I think he's one of the most brilliant X's and O's guys in the game.
I just don't think talent evaluation his strong point, and the proof is in the pudding, and you know what? .... that's OK. It's OK to defer to others who's sole job is to do the evaluation, right? That's why you hire people to make those decision. It's an entirely different skill set, IMO. That's all I am saying Notanexpert.
Look at your screen name. You aren't afraid to admit who you are or aren't, right?
In fact, Deebo is a perfect example of what I am talking about. Kyle gets so caught up on short area quickness, that he overlooked DK Metcalf's incredible overall game.
DeleteLike I told Grant Cohn .... Megatron ran a limited route tree his entire career, and guess what, it didn't matter that Megatron decided not to run the 3 cone drill simply because it wasn't his strongest trait.
How did that turn out for Megatron?
The forest through the trees, notanexpert .... the forest through the trees.
49Reasons cuz he could not play he improved his QB nuances: footwork, motion so maybe it was a plus for him,and what he had to proof he had a undefeated season as RS FRESHMAN on a pretty sophisticated offense for a college program, Mac Jones had a couple games more on a offense with lesser responsibilities, and Fields is less pro ready in terms of processing and pocketpresence and the seizure risk.
ReplyDeleteIf i had to decide i would consider everything involved:
Age.
With type of offense did they run.
Arm talent/strength/changing trajectory
Athleticism.
Football IQ.
Who will put the most work in it
mentally/physically.
Leadership can he rally a team and what type of leadership do we need a arrogant one of a Goofy one, or compared to hoe the team reacted to Jimmy G.
Upside.
ReplyDelete"We do this for a living, and I think people should be proud of us that we won’t let that affect our decision. And then it’s up to us to live with the consequences."
Should we be proud Shanny was distracted by Kirk Cousins and didn't do his due diligence on Mahomes or Watson?
Raz,
DeleteHow do you know that Shanahan didn’t do his due diligence on these two players? There may have been many factors involved in not drafting either Mahomes and Watson.
These guy’s were not exactly top 5 picks. Like Aaron Rodgers before them (who we also missed on), we don’t know what trajectory their careers would have gone playing on a team (49ers) that had no talent around them.
There’s a very good chance that whoever the 49ers draft as their QB will succeed because that QB will have a playoff ready team around them.
“I didn’t look into him as much as I should have. We definitely looked into him, studied all his tape. Was just a freak, could make any throw. Had the ability to do anything. It was a little bit situation for us. We had the second pick in the draft. Did not feel like from all the intel you get and stuff that he was going to go that high. And it was a little different situation for us because, I think it’s pretty well documented of just the relationship I had with Kirk being in Washington and everything. I felt very confident that he wasn’t going to stay there. When you go into a season knowing that a franchise quarterback is going to be available the next year, it made me a lot more picky with what we were looking at.”
DeleteWhat's kind of funny about the whole Mahomes thing is that the general consensus of draft experts was he was a bit of a reach at 10, despite the obvious talent. Many teams obviously felt the same way. Many fans too. 20-20 hindsight tells us this was a mistake.
DeleteYet once again fans are certain that X player is better than Y player, and taking Y player would be a huge reach/ mistake.
The real genius did not miss on Mahomes. The aspiring genius will get his chance this Thursday.
DeleteYep. Maybe he will follow Reid's example and take the guy people think is a reach, in the knowledge he fits what he wants the best?
DeleteMost importantly, Kyle was so singularly focused on Kirk Cousins, back in 2017, that he dropped the ball on evaluating all of the other QB's.
DeleteAs if Kirk Cousins is Aaron Rodgers or something. SMH!
Tunnel vision!
I don't think that a fair comparison, Scooter.
DeleteI think everyone knew Mahomes was an incredible physical talent, the big question was the development. Mahomes was a gunslinger in an air raid offense in college. The question was ... how would he develop his game in order to play within the structure of an NFL style offense.
Mac Jones is sort of the opposite, right? The questions have more to do with his physical limitations, right? Seems he'll have no choice but to play within the structure of an NFL offense if he has any chance of succeding, because he doesn't have the same physical gifts of some of the top prospects, or the QB's who are trending and succeeding in 2021.
ReplyDeleteJason La Canfora
@JasonLaCanfora
Very strong expectation among other GM's and throughout the industry that the 49ers will make major effort to move Jimmy Garoppolo before or during the draft. Timing isn't great with 5 QBs about to go in 1st round, but Jimmy G's future there now seen as bleak
1:06 PM · Apr 27, 2021
He's got a one way ticket to Patriots. Packing his bags, he could leave tonight.
ReplyDeleteYou love your musical analogies, don't you Razor. I find myself looking for the hidden musical references in all of your posts nowadays.
DeleteGaroppolo heading to NE? Why do we think that?
Kyle says: I packed his bags last night, pre-flight - 0 hour - 9:00 am - and I'm gonna be highhhh ... as a kite by then!
All of this science, I don't understand - it's just my job 5 days a week - a rocket arm - a rocket arm ....
Lol
Ha! Yea, it just makes it more fun for me. I've got an extensive rock/metal background as most of you know.
DeleteNicely done, 49Reasons.
Yah, I figured out your favorite music genre a long time ago. You seem well versed in all types of rock & roll, with a focus on heavy metal.
DeleteMy very first albums I ever owned were KISS - Alive, and AC/DC - If You Want Blood, You Got It (their only live album with the great Bon Scott) so I can appreciate that.
Cheers!
Your right Razor as a fan you have also the right to question things especially if they did mistakes before.
ReplyDeleteProday of Jones wasnt like Fields and Lance and that he needed more time to start than the other 2 is a valid concern, also talent level should also be a concern cuz Bama is a real powerhouse much more than OSU and NDSU.
Hoe will he fare as the least athletic of the bunch in the NFL?!!
And his belly compared to Fields and Lance should also be a flag in terms of preparation cuz he says he learned from his dui so why the belly than?!!
The 2 others are more serious IMHO.
ReplyDeleteIs there anyone else that would draft Drew Brees over Patrick Mahomes?
ReplyDeleteI would not make that mistake again.
Who's the Patrick Mahomes in this draft?
DeleteWho's the Drew Brees?
DeleteIf you remember I equated Wilson to Mahomes lite to Prime Time right before I made that bet Trask would not be drafted before pick 15.
Well, you know I think Jones gas Brees like qualities. I don't think either Fields or Lance are like Mahomes.
DeleteLance reminds me a lot of Josh Allen. Not just physically but his accuracy issues as well. Now you could tell that Allen's oc/quarterback coach knew how to develop a young qb. We have yet to see Shanny do just that.
DeleteIdd, but its more Matt Ryan/Kirk Cousins instead of Drew Brees
ReplyDeleteSounds to me like he thinks Jones is Drew Brees.
DeleteScooter would be very proud of the Drew Brees analogy, BTW, although I don't think Kyle was comparing those two.
DeleteOne thing I did like about Kyle's big answer at yesterday's presser, I always have an answer for next time my wife asks me what I am going to accomplished this weekend, or ever:
"Come on babe, I can't guarantee that anybody in the world will be alive by Sunday, and I can't guarantee there won't be a zombie apocalypse, so get off my back, women!!!"
@Razor:
DeleteSo what did KS mean by "You want to find Drew Brees who can move like Lamar Jackson"
His way of saying there is no such thing, but he found a Drew Brees who can move like Drew Brees.
DeleteThe Brees/ Jackson thing was no different to many of his previous comments. He wants an elite player from the pocket, and if that guy can run then even better.
DeleteKyle would prefer a QB who is elite In the pocket, AND very mobile. That's his ideal QB.
DeleteIt's OK to only have one of those traits, but not for 3 firsts and a 3rd.
And, BTW, nothing about Mac Jones tape guarantees he's elite from the pocket. His film says he's approaching elite status from the pocket, provided the pocket is CLEAN. Guess what? That's a lot of guys!
We don't know how good Mac Jones is from a muddy pocket because he was never tested. Guess what else .... welcome to the NFL, where a clean pocket is a rarely, NOT the norm!
Would be utterly crazy than , that means we still want a Bill Walsh as HC and not a egomaniac who fails to driver when its necessary
ReplyDeleteOr maybe 49Reasons KS thinks Trey Lance had the same toughness as Brees, dont see toughness in Jones.
ReplyDeleteI had this debate with Scooter, although in his defense, I now realize he was simply comparing traits.
DeleteBrees was absolutely The Man at Purdue. He broke every school record, Big Ten record, and many NCAA records, with 3 full seasons worth of absolute dominance!
Mac Jones lost QB battles in his first 3 years at BAMA. Once to Hurts, and twice to Tua. I seriously doubt Drew Brees would have lost those battles in college. Plus, Jones only really had one seasons worth of production. Now, that doesn't mean he's doomed to fail, it just means that he wasn't anywhere near as accomplished as Brees coming out of college. And for me, that matters a lot when comparing QB's.
Pretty sure the other QBs at Purdue weren't a future #5 and #51 overall draft pick.
DeleteAnd if that is a red flag... why do you like Fields?
But yeah, I didn't mean college career. Traits. Much like I am sure Shanahan was referring to pro QB Brees, not college QB Brees.
That's a fair point Scooter, but there was a lot of controversy when Fields lost out to Jake Fromm. Fields was the higher touted prospect coming out of HS, and many felt there was more to the story than losing to Fromm from a football standpoint. In fact, when Fields did see the field at Georgia, he outshined Fromm.
DeleteBut anyways, you got my point, and I eventually understood your valid point.
That said, it does beg the question ... why do people keep assuming Jones is the most ready to start as a rookie, of the big 3, even though he has the same amount of starts as Lance, and far far fewer starts against softer competition, than Fields?
I know you think Lance is the pick, Scooter, do you expect him to start in September if he is the pick? And is that the best approach in your opinion?
I expect whichever QB they select to be starting by the end of the season, and probably by mid season. Whether they start week 1 will depend on if JG is on the roster and how quickly the rookie picks things up.
DeleteI understand that, but I'm asking which direction do you think they should take, Scooter.
DeleteShould they take advantage of the opportunity to sit a QB behind Jimmy G. and allow him time to adjust to the NFL, before they start him?
Because that's doable, right? And if they do think that's the best approach, like they said at the presser, would it then make sense to draft the QB with the highest ceiling, assuming you believe he can be developed given the opportunity.
Or do you think, like some do, that the best way to acclimate to the NFL is trial by fire?
Tbh I think keeping JG around runs a risk of doing more harm than good. I'd rather see them trade JG, maybe trade for another vet QB (e.g. Minshew) and then let the rookie take over as soon as they believe he is ready. Ideally that would be week 1, but unlikely.
DeleteThe GM's job is to look out for the future health of the organization.
ReplyDeleteThe HC's job is to win now.
The GM's scouting dept. reaffirms the GM's choice.
Shanny picked wrong with Beathard. Why is our GM deferring?
I'm not seeing Shanny take a whole lot of responsibility for our qb woes, while Jimmy has been his excuse for it. Why do we need to get him out of here so fast without any competition in camp? Seems obvious to me. The reason is if Jimmy were to beat out Jones, Shanny would look foolish. Can't have that. I don't like it. Handing the job to a rookie without any real competition is a prescription for disaster.
ReplyDeleteRaz, have you ever suspected there's a ruse going on? That this is being done to influence Atlanta into a trade and Shanahan's real target is Pitts? He seems to be the least risky pick at this level.
DeleteI wish, George. Unfortunately, the ruse card is no longer in his deck after he made that trade.
DeletePeter King is saying there are a few teams willing to give a 2nd round pick for Jimmy.
ReplyDeleteJimmy G has a no-trade clause this year and he will not go to any team the Niners wants to. He's making $26M and is likely fine with Niners cutting him in case of any major disagreement.
DeleteI would disagree with that only because if he gets cut he won't make anywhere near the 26 mill he's making on his current contract. JG is a pro and my guess he will be willing to go anywhere that wants him.
DeleteMood, that really doesn't matter because Jimmy is out of guaranteed money. If he refuses a trade, the Niners will likely cut him, as they are only on the hook for less than $3M in dead money. And of Jimmy gets cut, his contract becomes void. If he accepts a trade, he will likely keep all, or at least most of his 2021 salary ($26+M), because whichever team trades for him is giving up draft picks in order to do it, so they will likely honor his contract this year, in order to avoid a big mess. They might, however, insist he take a pay cut as a condition of the trade, or try to get the Niners to take care of a portion of his contract, but that's also unlikely.
DeleteI hope that makes sense.
Link to Grant's final 7 round 49ers Mock Draft. Guests are Jack Hammer and CFC from the press democrat days.
ReplyDeletehttps://twitter.com/4evrnyt?ref_src=twsrc%5Egoogle%7Ctwcamp%5Eserp%7Ctwgr%5Eauthor
ReplyDelete4evrnyt
@4evrnyt
·
15h
One NFL GM told
@peter_king
that the 49ers 'ruined' the draft trade market with their move up to No. 3
----
Translation: Those dipshits overpaid and F'd it up for the rest of us.
I understand how they inflated Mac Jones' stock, but is this GM saying that they ruined the trade market for Jimmy G., or ruined the draft trade market in general (for everyone)?
DeleteRuined it in general for everyone else in the draft.
DeleteOK, I gotcha
Delete
ReplyDeleteMac Jones -200
Trey Lance +200
Justin Fields +300
Kyle Pitts +4400
Zach Wilson +5500
This is the next Drew Brees everyone:
ReplyDeletehttps://twitter.com/i/status/1387109690182619143
OMG .... that video!
DeleteEverybody thinks I'm being too hard on the kid, simply because I brought up the fact that he got busted crashing into cars while highly intoxicated, and also has a genuine beer belly.
But ....
Mac Jones is the great decision maker, they say.
Mac Jones is the smartest guy in the room, they say.
Thanks for finding that, Razor. You don't have John and Kyle's email address, by chance?
Oh, and he was drinking and driving on a fake driver's license, BTW, which goes to some degree of premeditation, right?
DeleteI'm not saying he shouldn't have an opportunity to redeem himself. He could have killed someone, bit he didn't.
However, how is this not a giant red flag? I don't get it. Why is he getting a complete pass, and why shouldn't this be cause for some concern? This bothers me. I don't hate the kid. I don't think he's a bad kid.
But, would anyone call this good judgement?
Meanwhile, Trey Lance is spending most of his personal off-time visiting children's hospitals.
DeleteYep, it is actually pretty well known even before the DUI became public that Jones was enjoying his college lifestyle a bit too much early on. But everything I have read suggests he got his head on straight a couple years back.
DeleteHis belly being the evidence?
DeleteThat may be true Scooter, I've heard the same thing, but you know how this stuff works. If Mac does end up making this kind of mistake as the 49ers QB, nobody is going to say what you just said.
DeleteAfter all, what happened the last time we took a highly touted prospect out of Alabama who had questions about off-field issues?
Besides, how do you account for the beer belly at his pro-day? That was only a few weeks ago.
All due respect, Scooter, you sure seem to be making a lot of excuses for Kyle and Mac.
DeleteScooter,
Delete"But everything I have read suggests he got his head on straight a couple years back."
Considering the excellent spin that the Bama program put on the Niners on Foster, would you trust any information coming out of that program?
No. I would be doing a lot more homework.
DeleteNiners claim to have done a lot of homework on Foster including sending their chaplain to talk to him and to various folks around him (guess they thought people would be less likely to lie to a man of God) but that didn't help. The Bama program seems to be as water-tight as the Niners' FO.
DeleteSo an 18/19 year old was drinking at a College party...gasp. Seriously you guys are trying to hard to find reasons to dislike him and ignoring the reasons why Shanahan would like him. Most football analysts that I've read or heard talk about him say the same things: He's the most accurate pocket passer, has the best anticipation and goes through his reads quickly. If you want to compare him to anybody compare him to most of the QB's Shanahan has Coached in his career because he obviously has a type and hasn't moved off of it.
DeleteDidn't know he was underage as well. Good catch, Notanexpert.
DeleteYep he was and that is no different from the other thousands of College students who do the same thing. If you are going to start basing a selection on what a kid did in College as a Freshman than there aren't going to be many players to choose from.
DeleteNot only was he underage and drinking, he used fake ID to get the drink. Then he drove drunk. Then he got into an accident. And all of this during football season.
DeleteA lot of strikes.
Does the "other thousands of College students" compile such a record?
It is one thing if this guy was just interviewing for a corporate scrub job.
Do you want your franchise QB displaying irresponsibility and exercising such poor judgement?
If there was a history of this type of behavior I wouldn't draft him but this is a one time mistake that happened a few years ago and by all accounts he's grown up a lot since then. Again I go back to the point of kids make mistakes, it's whether they learn from them that is most important and it appears he did.
DeleteJust to be clear -
ReplyDeleteI obviously don't have the slightest problem with Kyle choosing a different QB than the one I believe is the best available prospect at #3 (assuming Lawrence & Wilson go 1,2). That's obviously never been my issue.
I have no problem admitting Kyle knows more about the position than I do. In fact, Kyle's probably forgotten more about quarterbacks than I ever knew in the first place.
What I have a problem with is Kyle believing he knows more than EVERYBODY else, when it comes to evaluating these QB's. Does Kyle really know more all of these current HC's, former HC's, NFL scouts, ex-scouts, NFL executives, ex-executives, current and former players (including QB's), etc?
Well, his track record says no, no he doesn't! So maybe he ought to defer to the vast majority of experts, many of whom get paid a lot of money to evaluate prospects.
If I saw 100 doctors, and 95 of them told me I had cancer (knock on wood) but the other 5 gave me mixed diagnosis, who am I going to believe?
And when I say deferring to the "experts", I obviously meant to include his own scouting department.
DeleteWhat I have a problem with is Kyle believing he knows more than EVERYBODY else, when it comes to evaluating these QB's. Does Kyle really know more all of these current HC's, former HC's, NFL scouts, ex-scouts, NFL executives, ex-executives, current and former players (including QB's), etc?
DeleteAs I've said to you before, you don't know this to be the case. How do you know there are aren't other teams that think highly of Jones? What current HC's have come out and said he isn't any good? What you have are a small number of anonymous NFL sources saying these things along with just as many who like him and you don't know who they are or what their motives might be. The other thing you don't seem to grasp is that NFL teams do their own scouting and don't get caught up in opinions from outside sources. They spend hours upon hours studying these players, talking to them, talking to people who know them and form their own opinions based on what they find out.
You and Razoreater are questioning his ability to pick and develop a QB and yet he's had success with pretty much every QB he's ever Coached. If the worst you can say is the guy he used a 3rd round pick on to be a backup to Cousins didn't work out, that's not too bad.
Razor,
ReplyDeleteI sense your frustration and sympathize with it.
However, I am not sold on Kyle picking McRib until I actually see it happen.
I haven't had the time to watch yesterday's interview but from the reports it appears that Kyle was not happy with the pointed questions. His answers seem to indicate significant irritation with having a presser 4 days before the draft.
Anyway, I don't think any QB chosen by the Shannys at #3 will be a bust. If it's McRib, then, as Mike Tanier put it, Kyle will go all out to make sure that he's going to be the arithmetic mean of Cousins and Ryan. I think Niners can win a Super Bowl with Jones, but won't be a perennial contender even if they have a top-notch defense.
He won't be a bust but will he be better than Jimmy?
DeleteWill he ever be worth just one 1st round pick after this draft is over? He's like a new car that once you drive him off the lot, those 3 1st round picks depreciate rather quickly.
If he's drafted by the Niners, we won't know how good he is for 2-3 seasons (40 games or more). Kyle will scheme up to ensure that we won't be screaming bust anytime soon.
DeleteScooter, question for you. Why is our GM deferring to the HC on the quarterback decision when, a. he chose Beathard/Cousins over Marhomes and Watson, and b. both GM and asst. and scouting dept. all on board team Lance?
ReplyDeleteBonus question: Why is this being aired out in the media?
My take: when Jones fails, Lynch/Peters and scouting dept. reputations will be strengthened as well as consolidating Shanny's immense power that he's now enjoying.
Our GM is deferring to the HC because he knows whoever they take will be working closely with Shanahan, not the GM.
DeleteAnd it will be Lance.
Not his job to defer to the head coach. His job is the long term health of the organization and to make the best decisions. You have to know that gm's and hc's don't normally get along because they are working towards the same goal but on different paths getting there.
DeleteI think it would be silly not to take his HC's opinion on this.
DeleteNot talking about his opinion. I'm talking about deferring. You do not defer when you have the same conviction as your top general and staff. You don't defer when the hc has proven himself less than stellar at picking quarterbacks. Hell, he has a hard time picking wr's until he hit on Aiyuk. Samuel is more rb than wr for mine.
DeleteRazor,
DeleteLynch's job is whatever they have decided in the contract with Jed.
I don't think that it's a surprise to anyone that Kyle makes the final pick out of a vetted set of finalists. I'm confident that Lynch is privy to Kyle's reasoning and the two have discussed pros and cons of picking whoever they will pick. Lynch has no basis for any more confidence about what Kyle can get out of his QB than Kyle himself.
That may be but the traditional GM position does not answer to the HC.
DeleteTrue. Kyle is among 3-4 coaches in the league currently who have final say on some or all personnel matters. However, this has been known since 2017 when the regime took over.
DeleteOnly fans like us would have known that because this is the first overt admission that I'm aware of. In fact, I don't believe I've ever heard a gm say publicly that he defers to anyone other than the owner.
DeleteWhy are we deferring to someone that's been wrong and hasn't developed anyone at the position?
Mood Indigo is right. It was known pretty much from the day they were hired that Shanahan had final say on personnel at least the final 53 anyway. As far as him not developing anybody who was he supposed to develop that he didn't? Beathard was never viewed as a starting option for this team and neither was Mullens. Almost every starting caliber QB Shanahan has Coached and/or called plays for has had success. This will be the first time he has personally invested a first round pick on a QB and developed him which is one of the reasons I don't get all the criticism of him for doing it.
Delete@NAE.
DeleteI agree with most of the above. I think Lynch and Kyle approach the process in a collaborative manner. Generally Kyle picks offensive finalists and Lynch does the same for defense. The may have strong reservations on some candidates but no players is worth a fallout of their relationship.
On the other issue, it's true that this is the first time Kyle has selected a top QB pick. However, his QB coaching is record is not proving to be very good. Keep in mind he can claim only two years in influencing Cousins' development. He was not been able to develop Beathard or Mullens into serviceable backups for his team. Is Jimmy G a better QB now than when he arrived?
Kyle is an outstanding play designer and a superior play caller. As yet, I'm not convinced in his ability to develop young QBs. I'm nervous about his ability to select top QBs based on his Dad's track record if they both aimilar outlook on QB potential.
Fair enough. I just see it differently is all. I don't think you develop back ups unless you see them as eventual starters and I don't think Beathard and Mullens were ever viewed in that way. Both had moments with Mullens actually playing pretty well the first year he had to replace JG, but they are backups for a reason. They have limited ability and when you combine that with not getting a lot of snaps while serving as the backup or 3rd string QB, I don't see that as a negative on Shanahan's ability to develop QB's. The reason I'm optimistic is because Kyle has had success with every starting caliber QB he's ever had and success with some non starting caliber QB's. What he hasn't had is a high first round pick he made to develop and design plays for. RG3 was not somebody he and his father wanted but they still had success with him his first year so I believe there's a very good chance Kyle will have success with somebody he has hand picked himself. I could be completely wrong in that belief but I'm not going to draw a conclusion until I see it play out.
DeleteOh man, guys, you have to read TONY PAULINE'S latest scoop. He just posted it about an hour ago. If it's true, and the Niners take Jones (a lot of it lines up exactly with what I've heard and read,), I'll be boycotting the 49ers for the first time in 38 years.
DeleteIn a nutshell: His sources are telling him that the original plan was to draft Trey Lance. But now, because they were unable to sign a veteran, and Kyle wants Jimmy out of the building, Kyle plans to draft Jones (even though John Lynch, Adam Peters, and Ran Carthon all want Lance) simply because he thinks Jones is more NFL ready to start this season.
So, Mac Jones is plan B, mostly because Kyle has a personal grudge against Jimmy G, and wants him gone.
Un-fricken-real! Wow, just wow! I truly am seeing red right now.
Does that sound real to you?
DeleteYes, it does actually.
DeleteAnd according to Pauline, Kyle Shanahan is "driving the draft process" for the 49ers right now. Pauline also points out that when a HC is driving the draft process rather than the GM - leaning on his scouting department, the results are usually very different.
DeleteYou have very little faith in this front office.
DeleteScooter, you know a lot of this lines up with what we've seen, and actually makes sense of everything.
DeleteOh boy, my wife is cracking the whip and giving me the ultimatum because I apparently I have "anger management issues" so I gotta go, guys.
good luck Thursday night. You may or may not hear from me for a while after that, depending on how it turns out.
Peace!
None of that makes sense. They've done everything they can to accommodate JG's contract plus a rookie. Everything Shanahan has said suggests a completely different story.
DeleteWhat I suspect may happen is that JG may want to leave, which could force their hand. But even so, it would make no sense to take a guy Shanahan doesn't think is the best long term option. Just trade for another vet as well to be stop gap.
Sorry, what Pauline said makes very little sense, and does not line up with the teams words or actions.
I am on the can, sneaking one last post, so I can just say this one last thing, Scooter.
DeleteNO, I DO NOT TRUST KYLE SHANAHAN as a talent evaluator. Time and time again he's shown that he lets his emotions cloud his judgement. There is a reason the preferred model is the GM and his staff and scouting department make the picks, not the HC. Sure, they might run stuff by the HC, and get some input, but it's the GM and the personnel staff that are driving the draft process. I have a sense that Kyle is absolutely driving this process, and especially in regards to this first pick.
And I'll say it again. Great Head Coach, great OC, LOUSY talent evaluator. Kyle gets to Personally invested in these picks, call it emotions or what have you, and it absolutely clouds the judgement. It's important to keep personal feeling out of the process.
Nothing about the way this has played out since the trade has made a lot of sense to me, or my friends/acquaintances, and I feel like this has disaster written all over it.
Gotta good, Scooter , catch you later.
49Reasons,
DeleteShanahan is the architect of the offense. Why shouldn’t he choose the QB he believes can run it?
I doubt the scouting dept or anyone else knew that Shanny wanted to trade down till it happened. As far as I am concerned, you don't make a trade down without already having a really good idea on who the pick is. Shanny saw somebody he wanted, went to York, no problem went and made the trade. The pick was in the moment the trade was made.
ReplyDeleteIf I'm playing against Jone's I'll play man to man. No worries about him taking off. What a relief for opposing defenses.
ReplyDeletePer 49ersWebzone. Phone interview with Daniel Jeremiah.
ReplyDelete"Trying to do my homework on this pick in the last couple of days, I talked to somebody who had interviewed Kyle for a head-coaching job before he got the Niners job, and he said, 'When we talked about quarterbacks, he said it begins and ends with accuracy,'" Jeremiah said. "Like, that is the most important thing, is how accurate you are with the football. And that's a huge strength of Mac Jones."
Jones completed an impressive 77.4 percent of his passes last season against some good competition. Fields completed 70.2 percent of his passes. In 2019, during his last full season, Lance completed 66.9 percent of his passes.
"So, [Jones doesn't have] the arm strength, not the great athlete," Jeremiah continued. "Obviously, you hear about how smart he is, how quick he processes, all those things. But if accuracy is the be-all, end-all, the guy completes 77 percent of his passes. He's the most accurate guy right now. So, that's why, in my opinion, that's why Kyle is where he is on this evaluation."
Another talking head that seems to favor Jones- which really means nothing at this point. The 49ers could go a number of ways at #3. Heck, they may even go with the kid that many analysts call the best prospect in the draft- Kyle Pitts.
Sheesh, Thursday can’t come soon enough!
We'll see how accurate he is when McGlinchey gets knocked backward on his ass into Jones' lap.
Deleteyup -- he question is how accurate is he going to be with The Donald in his lap.
DeleteTo paraphrase a saying of the great American sports philosopher, Mike Tyson: "Every college QB throwing out of a clean pocket is accurate until he gets hit in the mouth by the pass rusher".
Actually AES, I read this piece of Jeremiah's. NO, he doesn't favor Jones. In fact, Jeremiah said in that same piece that if it were up to him, he'd take both Lance and Fields over Jones, because -
DeleteA) he thinks both Lance and Fields can be as accurate as Jones,
and
B) because of their ability to expand the playbook!
BTW, analytically speaking, considering ball placement, Justin Fields was actually more accurate than Jones!
Just wanted to clear that up, bro. Go read his entire piece.
The "great sports philosopher - Mike Tyson", lol, I love it.
DeleteBTW, Tyson really is a softy after you get past his alter-ego. I really like the guy.
Maybe Mike McGlinchey can borrow Mac's mid-section, right Raz, it might help him anchor the perimeter next year.
DeleteNo QB is going to have success if he has a defensive player in his lap and before you tell me that won't happen with an athletic QB like FIelds or Lance, go look at how many times Fields was sacked during his time at OSU. Sacks don't just happen because a QB isn't athletic enough. They also happen because the QB doesn't get rid of the football quickly enough which is why Fields took a lot of sacks and Jones didn't.
DeleteYes, and before people start claiming Jones didn't take sacks because he wasn't put under pressure, he also had the lowest sack % of the top 5 QBs per snap under pressure. He does a very good job moving in the pocket to avoid pressure.
Delete@NAE
DeleteJimmy G can get rid of the ball plenty fast. Maybe Kyle is seeking a healthier version of Jimmy G? Getting rid of the ball fast to a receiver every time the pocket shrinks quickly doesn't really happen in practice in NFL, especially on third and long.
Fields did hold on to the ball too long but how much of that was result of the scheme need or a receiver who eventually beat coverage deep? How much of Jones's decisive, precise throws were schemed and successfully executed with the help of top-10 receivers.
We can't project how players will play in the NFL over 3 years, but we can project what physical limitations will prevent them from doing. Jones's physical limitations will always prevent him backpedaling 15 feet and throwing on the third and 15 that Mahomes did in the Super Bowl. It will likely prevent him from avoiding the sack that Ryan took and sealed the Super Bowl loss.
Interestingly, the fans of the other NFCW teams wanted the Niners to pick Jones in a recent poll.
49Reasons,
DeleteYou’re right that Jeremiah did not commit to Jones, but the stat he put up regarding completions for Jones is what stood out for me. As well as Jeremiah’ comments that a high completion rate in a QB is what Shanahan looks for. Jones fits Shanahan’ model, at least on paper.
We’ll all find out in a couple days what exactly Shanahan wants in his QB.
Mood Indigo,
DeleteI believe Shanahan has always liked Garoppolo and have never bought into the belief he doesn't think he can run the system well enough for his liking so it wouldn't surprise me if he views Jones in the same vein as Garoppolo or Ryan or Schaub for that matter. It's quite clear based on his history that he likes QB's who stay in the pocket and run the play the way it's designed. The play you referenced by Mahomes is the exception not the rule. He can do things like that but most can't which is why trying to chase the next Mahomes is futile. The belief that the league has changed and you need to have a dual threat QB or one who can make incredible plays off schedule isn't real in my opinion and I don't think many Coaches are looking for that element as the main criteria for drafting them. The number one job of a QB still remains throwing the ball from the pocket and that will never change. Jones is able to move within the pocket and get the ball out quickly and accurately. That is the number on criteria for Shanahan and most other HC's and OC's I would imagine. The Mahomes highlight reel plays are an added bonus but shouldn't be an expectation.
The fans of the other NFCW teams are likely buying into the same propaganda. At the end of the day the only QB in the division who has won anything is Russell Wilson. Murray and Stafford are popular with the masses but have won nothing. If Jones helps us win games I don't care what he looks like or how fast he runs.
Notanexpert,
DeleteI agree. There seems to be this thought that the only way to win football games in this day and age is to have an athletic QB.
Yet, Cam, Watson, Jackson and dating back to Fran Tarkington have not won a SB.
I’m glad that Shanahan is not swayed by the popular view among the football analysts and 49ers fans.
I will respect that he will chose a QB according to who he believes gives the team the best prospect of eventually winning a SB.
Fair enough AES.
DeleteI do think it's worth noting that Mac Jones threw the most screens and dumped the ball off the his RB more than the other top prospects as well. He had the lowest percentage of yards thrown through the air per throw, so that screens dink-and-dunk.
Oops
DeleteMac Jones screams DINK N DUNK
I'm told that there are a significant number of teams who view Mac Jones as a backup QB at the NFL level.
DeleteNo joke!
who told you that
DeleteI don’t mind a QB who dinks and dunks his way to a National Championship. Would you be upset if Jones dinks and dunks his way to a SB title?
DeleteThe Jones criticism isn’t really based on anything concrete. The kid is a proven winner and that still matters in my book. Of the 3 QBs that could become a starter in 2021, it’s Jones for me.
The athletic QB is a bit overhyped and overrated imho. The SB win record between a pocket QB vs the athletic QB confirms my point.
The pocket QB is still a very viable asset in pro football.
@NAE
DeleteI am not questioning that Kyle has preferred strictly pocket QBs in the past. But he's gotta be blind if he doesn't see that the NFL has changed. All the top QBs under 30 are now QBs with strong athletic instincts. Kyle's awesome offense has failed in the critical moments at the highest level of the Super Bowl because of lack of athleticism of his QBs. His offense's pass pro will never be in the top 10 because of his stretch run scheme and will always be the weakest in the interior because his tackles will be the highest paid O linemen. He's gotta realize that he needs to change his approach.
We're talking maybe 5% of the talking heads actually prefer Jones over either Fields or Lance.
ReplyDeleteMore importantly, the vast majority of NFL executives and scouts prefer Fields and Lance over Jones.
The negative analysis on Jones revolves solely around his lack of athleticism and not having a bazooka for an arm. That is a product of the infatuation with the QB's who can throw from any arm angle and make plays off schedule like Mahomes. What isn't being talked about however is that these types of plays are a very small percentage of what happens during a game. In order to have sustained success you need a QB who can read what he's seeing, find the right option and deliver it accurately and quickly. That's what dictates how successful a QB will be long term and Jones fits that criteria.
DeleteYep.
DeleteNo, there's a lot more to it than that, guys.
DeleteFirst of all, Mac Jones threw for the fewest yards per throw, through the air. Secondly, he always threw from a clean pocket. Thirdly, he played on a college all star team, with receivers who would almost always win their route, and almost always make the catch almost regardless of ball placement. And he also threw to the best receiving RB in the FBS.
You don't have to have a howitzer to succeed in the NFL. But you do have to have enough arm strength to make all of the throws, and you have to have good ball placement, ESPECIALLY if you are a one-deminsional QB due to lack of athleticism.
Mac Jones almost always worked from a clean pocket, and when it wasn't clean, he usually didn't fare well. There is even a video titled "Mac Jones can take a bad play, and make it worse."
And a lot of times, Mac would simply let the ball go before his receivers were open. Now, some will call that great anticipation, but is it really, if you know your WR's will almost always find a way to make a play. Big difference in the NFL when CB's are much quicker, faster, and windows are much smaller.
IIRC, Jones's accuracy when throwing on the run isn't all that good.
DeleteAlso IIRC, advanced metrics did not treat him well. I can did up the numbers but McRib does not enthuse me sufficiently to do so :(
I hear a lot about Mac Jones' athleticism. If he reaches Jimmy's level (prior to Jimmy's knee injury), is that good enough? IIRC, Jimmy could run when necessary and while not Jackson wasn't that bad. Once Jones gets into an NFL program they'll be working on his body. Heck, if he is as proactive and thoughtful as he should be, he's probably already been working on improving his conditioning and physique. If he hasn't been, that would be a red flag for me.
ReplyDeleteCubus,
DeleteI don’t believe that any 49er QB will receive any accolades (whether it’s Lance, Fields or Jones) until he brings home a Lombardi.
AES. True. Whoever gets selected is going to have to have a very thick skin. But hey, I hear New York is worse.
DeleteMontana, Young, and even Garcia.
DeleteBig shoes to fill!
I've Been out of town for a few days with no time to keep up with the latest on the blog! Good to see that we're still beating a dead horse and I didn't miss anything and I refuse to get wrapped around the axel on the QB KS drafts. Besides, If I'm to believe the blog, he's an arrogant, obtuse buffoon that needs to be put in his place! How dare he decides who fits the offensive scheme that he develop, when there are people on his staff (collectively, or individually), that know more than he does? What a Cretin!
ReplyDeleteBesides, we'll know what we're complaining about when the fat lady (Goodell), Sings and KS drafts a QB that we approve of!
In the mean time, here's my wish list as my mock draft.
#3: I think Fields is the 2nd best QB in the 2021 draft.
#43: There are several options I've looked at, but finally decided on trading down, plus an additional Rd #3 player.
Rd #2: CB Erick Stokes
Rd #3 extra pick: TE Brevin Jordan. Despite playing for 3 OC, he showed success. 9er coaching and weight room will help realize full potential.
Rd #3 Pick #102: EDGE Patrick Jones.
Rd #4 Pick #117: WR Nico Collins. Big possession receiver. Successful despite inconsistent coaching and quarterback play at Michigan. sat out 2020 season.
Rd #5 Pick #155: S/CB Tre Norwood
Pick #172: Drew Dalton C/G
Pick #180: OLB Charles Snowden,
Rd #6 Pick #194: RB Pooka williams. Small 5'9" X 170, 4.36s 40, Fits Shanahan's ZBS system. Has Off filed red flag for domestic violence against girlfriend that will need to be addressed and may take him off some team draft boards?
Rd #7 Pick #230: OT Tommy Doyle, Miami. He has talent, with good NFL coaching could become a depth player, but will start out as developmental OT.
Get your popcorn ready and I hope you all enjoy draftmas
Looks good to me, GEEP!
DeleteNice “drop” GEEP.
ReplyDeleteMy only hesitation would be to see Pooka Williams slide to the 6 RD. Other than that, everything looks good and I’d be happy with the Fields as well.
Thanks AES
DeleteRE Pooka...I think the Domestic Violence red flag could mean he doesn't get drafted? I suspect the NFL is sensitive about players with a DM on their record. If his lawyers can clean that up, I agree, he'll climb the draft boards
Good point GEEP. I admit that I haven’t done any off field checks on any players in this draft.
ReplyDeleteThe DM charge is certainly a big concern.
https://youtu.be/d7wcG6Cfkqg
ReplyDelete2 dui and a blackface
I didn't realize the blackface. If true, Kyle won't pick him, so to me the likely choice is Fields.
DeleteBlackface=Radioactive
ReplyDeleteNot matter how good a qb he is.
Bridgewater to Broncos for a 6th rounder.
ReplyDelete